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Are pickup artist strategies misogynistic?

Pickup artist strategies are labeled misogynistic by critics who believe that many specific strategies prey on weakness in women, but more deeply, that the philosophy of a pickup artist entails a sexist conception of women.

Implications to Other Questions

Are pickup artist strategies morally acceptable?
Are pickup artist strategies misogynistic?

Experts and Influencers

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Agree
Experts In Feminism


Amanda Marcotte    Blogger, Author, Feminist
Agree
The people most being manipulated here are the sad sack misogynists who are so busy throwing a no pussy blues pity party that they can’t even grasp that their inability to see that women are basically people is being exploited to free them of their spare cash. ... the concept that a woman’s will is merely an obstacle between you and her pussy ... then I fail to see how that doesn’t slide into making excuses for and even outright calling for sexual assault.
11 Aug 2009    Source


Experts In Media


Anna North    Blogger
Agree
Roissy and his pickup-artist ilk don't advocate the murder of women. But the worldview they promulgate does appear to inspire murderous thoughts. We don't know if Sodini visited misogynist websites during the long period in which he was planning his crime. We do know that he lived in a society where some people view hatred and even murder as a normal response to dating difficulties — if Roissy's violent "eunuchracy" ever comes to pass, these people will bear some of the blame.
05 Aug 2009    Source


Elizabeth Nolan Brown    Journalist
Agree
For socially conservative writers, PUAs provide a way to vindicate their otherwise past-oriented views about marriage, sex, and cultural decline by squeezing them (never quite comfortably) into the framework of the cutting-edge. It’s relevance by any means necessary. And so Game devotees are transformed from an assortment of bitter and manipulative losers, deviants, and wimps into the logical response to a “feminized” culture.
01 Apr 2010    Source


Disagree
Experts In Seduction


Heartiste    Pickup Artist
Disagree
Most women, and some men, believe that the bitterness and misogyny of beta males accounts for their failure with women. That betas are their own worst enemy. It is a common human compulsion to want to believe that the tortures of the sexually damned are self-inflicted — unlike poverty or gender discrimination, the first instinct of the moralizers in matters of unequal distribution of sex and love is to blame the victim.
30 Jul 2007    Source


Mystery    Pickup Artist, Celebrity, Author
Disagree
The misogyny thing, of course I'm going to have to deal with the preconceived notions of the stereotype of a player. ... [In response to the question: If your method is as effective as you say it is, do you worry about it getting into the wrong hands and being abused?] Well, I can't worry about it. Are there bad people out there? Yeah. Aren't there people who want to use *any* tool for evil?
06 Aug 2007    Source


Suggested Expert Quotes


Marc
This, once again, goes to show that the pick-up artist needs a reality check - a reality that's often muddled by misogynistic pornography, male entitlement, and the belief that all women are attracted to money, and that if a man has enough money, he would be able to impress (see "buy") her. The problem with the pick-up artist, then, is that he refuses to see women as human beings...



Comments

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0 Points      dionisos      22 Aug 2016      Stance on Question: Mostly Disagree
The same thing than Nutz. (it is not mean to be a useful comment, sorry, it is only that i am forced to comment if i want enough data to see who agree which me)


0 Points      TheLobsterMan      21 Dec 2011      Stance on Question: Agree
They fundamentally do not recognize the woman as an equal.


0 Points      Nutz      31 May 2010      Stance on Question: Disagree
Calling pickup artists misogynists is only afforded if one misuses the term. Misogyny is the hatred of women. Period. Full stop. Trying to have sex with women is incompatible with the very term unless the man is some kind of a masochist. Furthermore, pickup is truly just a form of public speaking geared towards interpersonal relationships between men and women. In other words it's a communication skill. HOW the skill is used depends on one's intent, so the skill itself is neither good nor bad, it's all in how one uses it just as a weapon is neither good nor evil, it's all about the intentions of the user.


0 Points      Anonymous      03 Apr 2012      Stance on Question: Agree
I'm afraid this is rubbish.



0 Points      the27th      26 May 2010      Stance on Question: Agree
Yes, it's misogynistic.

What is misogyny? I think it's best described as ill will towards women. An attempt to harm women, qua women, is misogynistic.

The theory of pick up artists is based on trying to make the dating world less favorable to women -- conning them into sleeping with a man they would otherwise dislike. The language is usually to the effect that women have the upper hand, and it's time to cut them down to size. This is really tautologically anti-woman.

Here's what bothers me particularly. I think one of the worst ways to harm a person is to weaken his or her character, to sabotage his or her good qualities. PUA tells men to manipulate women into being their worst selves -- impulsive, emotional, gullible, petty. That's a very nasty kind of ill will.


1 Point      Keller Scholl      27 May 2011      Stance on Question: Disagree
No. Not at all. The goal of a pickup artist is to help guys get girls. They tackled social anxiety and false expectations and how to mimic or learn the tactics of men who would do it instinctively. What a PUA does is help men who aren't arrogant asses pick up the usefull tactics of the arrogant asses for the goal of meeting, and potentially sleeping with, women. It is about getting a woman to sleep with a man she otherwise wouldn't but your assumption is that that woman's judgement is automatically correct, which is absurdity beyond measure. As for the idea that women don't have the upper hand in dating, I sincerely wonder if you have ever tried to be in a heterosexual relationship that would be considered "normal" in the slightest sense. Flowers, chocolates, paying for dates, men are trying to get women interested in them with all this and more. Men ask a woman out, not the other way around in normal society. How can you seriously claim that women don't have the upper hand?

PUAs use and teach emotional manipulation techniques. That does not mean they are trying to harm "women as a group," it means that they are trying to help some men. Yes, these techniques often use the worst aspects of someones personality. But so does being a highly muscled jock with a naturally alpha male personality. Unless life is a zero sum game between genders, your comment is impossible.

After attacking your comments point by point, I feel a need to address the overall issue. Namely, that you seem to think the status quo pre PUA's is an inherently good thing, without offering evidence or logic. Personally, I don't see how women are harmed by having more attractive options. I also don't see how success for men is inherently harm for women. Could you please explain?